Radio Maine Episode 9: Hadley Powell
Hadley Powell has spent a lifetime “training her eye” when it comes to art. Visits to art museums were an integral part of her childhood vacations and time at Gould Academy in Bethel, Maine expanded her view. She went on to complete formal educational programs in art at Union College and with Christie’s world-renowned art institute. Now, in tandem with nurturing her young family, Hadley is maturing her art consulting business, Powell Fine Art Advisory. Listen to this Farmington, Maine native talk about art, family, entrepreneurship, and her never-ending and always evolving love of art.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: I am Lisa Belisle and you are watching, or listening to, Radio Maine. Today I have a very special guest with me. Her name is Hadley Powell and she's an art consultant. Welcome to Radio Maine, Hadley.
Hadley Powell: Thank you so much for having me. It's a real treat.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: I'm especially interested to hear about your connection to Maine because it runs pretty deep, doesn't it?
Hadley Powell: Yes, absolutely. I was born and raised in Western Maine. My parents moved there in the seventies. I feel like I'm a true Mainer in every sense of the word. I actually met my husband in Maine one summer. His family had actually spent their summers in Maine for his whole life. So it's a special place for both me, because I grew up there, but it’s also special for our entire family.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Now, you’ve said that your parents came to Maine in the seventies. Were they part of the back to the lander group or what was the connection?
Hadley Powell: I think they were friends with a lot of the back to the lander group but they actually met in Boston. My dad is a minister and had been at the Harvard Divinity School. There was a posting for an internship in Farmington, Maine at a small church there. So he did it. He went up one summer and did the internship. And my mom, they were dating at the time, came to visit him and they completely fell in love with the town and the people. He was offered a job. It was going to be sort of a five-year stint for him, which turned into 35 years. My parents raised me and my sister in Farmington. Then I went to Gould Academy, which is a small boarding school in Bethel, Maine and I have loved Maine ever since
Dr. Lisa Belisle: And not to get too far off the track of Hadley versus Hadley's family, but tell me about the very special ministry that your father did. That was actually quite unique. It wasn't the same type of ministry that everybody everywhere did.
Hadley Powell: Well, he was a Presbyterian minister for the bulk of his career but then for the last 10 years, he was the director of the Maine Seacoast Mission, which is actually based in Bar Harbor. They've now moved to Northeast Harbor, Maine on Mount Desert Island. And what’s exciting about the Maine Seacoast Mission is that they have this incredible boat called the Sunbeam, which is a steel hulled ice breaker. It goes out to many of the small islands off the coast of Maine. My father has since retired, but with COVID they've been vaccinating Islanders. And so they've been going out and doing both, ministry as well as social services, as well as community building. It's a really great organization.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: I happened to have been on the Sunbeam; actually more than once. One time overnight because I was interested in the work they were doing, medically. And so, I had a chance to connect with a doctor on the mainland that they were video conferencing in, and it was really interesting to see the use of technology. This was quite a few years ago and this was before we were all doing telemedicine.
Hadley Powell: Telemedicine initiatives have been amazing and, exactly, especially now that everyone is sort of going much more towards the video conferencing direction, it's a much more natural experience, I think now.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Well, speaking of the video experience, how has this impacted the work that you do as an art consultant?
Hadley Powell: Sure. It's been a really interesting you know. I think when COVID first hit, and we were all in lockdown last spring and into the summer, everyone was sort of frozen in many ways, trying to sort of understand how they were going to navigate this new world. We've all had to adapt. I've been utilizing zoom with clients, which actually has been pretty similar to how I would interact in the past because often when I'm starting to work with a client, I'll put together a proposal, you know, usually see images of the home or go tour the home. And so that was obviously a little different, but, I'll put together a proposal of ideas and then I would take them through the proposal over zoom. So it was not the same as being there in person, but we could kind of move pretty quickly.
Hadley Powell: And then once decisions were starting to be made and we had a sense for what artworks the client really wanted to see, we would be working. I would work to either have artwork shipped or I would physically bring the artwork into the home. And actually that's really sort of when I started working really closely with the Portland Art Gallery, because Emma was so amazing and would bring me carloads of artwork to client's homes so we could see things in person, obviously making sure we were all being really safe, but there were definitely adjustments we've been making. Also just boosting my digital presence. So when COVID hit, I started a podcast. I'd always been doing a newsletter, but I went from sort of quarterly to monthly. And then also utilizing Instagram more and more to really reach out to my clients.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: You've also done this all while raising your family at the same time.
Hadley Powell: Yes. And that obviously has been a struggle, especially with a two year old who historically would love to go to museums and galleries herself and we would take her all the time. And since COVID, we haven't gone as much, we've started to go a little bit more now that things are opening up a little bit more, but it was hard not being able to have family museum dates, which is what we had been doing a lot when she was first born.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: And then you added another member of the family in the middle of all of this as well,
Hadley Powell: Three weeks ago. So baby Aster was born three weeks ago. She's happily sleeping in the room next to me and I hope that she stays that way for the next half an hour or so.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: So this was interesting to me because you have clearly integrated your work and your family life pretty much from the beginning. It seems like it's been important to you to do that.
Hadley Powell: It is, that's a really thoughtful question and something that I care a lot about. I will say my husband is a lawyer, so he has a completely different profession, but he's also really passionate about the arts. And that was something that sort of brought us together from day one. And he loves to go to museums and galleries with me and he's done some photography himself. He's sort of like the man behind my Instagram account. But it is, it's something that I care a lot about because for me it's so much more than just a job, it's really a passion. And so it's something I'm thinking about all day every day. And when you have your own business, you kind of have to be doing that. You have to really care. And so weekends are often spent thinking about artwork, sometimes seeing clients, evenings the same, with that I have great flexibility, which is something that was really a goal for me. To be able to have at this point, in this stage in my life, have that flexibility so that I could be with my kids when I wanted to, but also working in a role that, that facilitated that. But it is, it's something that I care a lot about.
Hadley Powell: And, you know, when we could travel, our travel always was associated with art, be it to an art fair or to a city in Europe that had a great museum. Art has become completely integrated into my life.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Tell me about growing up and growing into your love of art, because it sounds like you've really done a lot with your own children in this area, but I'm guessing that you had some of this sort of experience incorporated into your childhood as well.
Hadley Powell: Definitely and that's actually a trend I've seen with a lot of people in the arts. When I worked at Christie's in New York and would talk to my colleagues, we'd all kind of ask , you know, when did you first fall in love with artwork? And basically everyone said it was because their parents took them to museums as a kid. And that's something that's really important because you have to be constantly training your eye. And so you need to have years and years and years of doing that. And I remember going to the National Gallery in Washington with my parents when I was like six. So that I think was a big part of my love of art is because my parents were always interested in art and looking at art and talking about art. Not in a way that they would never call themselves collectors, but they are very sort of aesthetically attuned.
Hadley Powell: My dad loves photography. He wrote part of his senior thesis on Walker Evans. So that's always been a thread. And then my mom has the greatest aesthetic and loves design. And so both of those things definitely sort of filtered into me and they've always been completely supportive of my interest in the arts. So when I was in college and I decided I was switching from an IEC becoming an econ major to an art history major, they were both super supportive and happy that I did that. And whenever I would want to go to museums or whenever we would travel and I was interested in sort of checking out the art scene, they were onboard.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: You also had an experience at Gould that kind of solidified your love of art.
Hadley Powell: Well, Gould just has an amazing visual arts program. They had what, at the time, was like the art cottage and some of my favorite teachers at Gould were all arts, art teachers. My soccer coach was a metal worker. And so it was really neat to be surrounded by that at such a young age. So I took photography at Gould and everyone takes sort of like an intro to design. Being around a community that really supported and was interested in the arts has always been something that I've sort of looked at and enjoyed.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: So you talked a little bit earlier about training the eye and having this be, basically a lifelong process, whether we realize it or not. Do you think that one of the things that you have to offer as an art consultant is to help people, I guess, train their own eyes or look at things with a fresh set of eyes so that they can see how art might fit into their own spaces?
Hadley Powell: Absolutely. I think that one thing that I do as an art consultant, or that my clients hire me for, is that expertise. There's so much out there and it can be completely overwhelming, especially if you're new to looking at art. I essentially narrow down the field for them. I can show them some 10 items versus 100 or 10 versus 30, and really begin to focus for them and share things you should be looking for. One thing that I always tell clients is "think about what the artist was trying? What was the goal for the artwork? What was the artist trying to accomplish? What's the idea, and did they do that successfully?" And so if you approach artwork in that way, if you have a set of questions to ask as you're reviewing the artwork, it can be really helpful, to fine tune what is what, what's successful, what's working and what's not.
Hadley Powell: And then, obviously, it's personal taste. Sometimes people need to have someone to validate that their taste is great. They are always drawn to something, be it a color or a form or a subject. And that's okay. Allowing people to feel like, even though they maybe didn't study art in college, or haven't spent a ton of time looking at art, if they continue to gravitate toward the same thing, that it means something. Let's look at that and let's talk about that. So that's a lot of the training that I do with clients. It's a lot of education. When clients are just starting out, we spend a lot of time. I sent them books before COVID. We'd go to art fairs together. We'd go to galleries together. I'd just be sharing them images constantly just to get a sense for what it is they are interested in. What's sparking some curiosity or not interested in at all?
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Is it hard for people to get to that place where they feel safe, trusting their own instinct when it comes to art?
Hadley Powell: I think it completely depends. It completely depends on your background and if you grew up with artwork. I think it helps to sort of have someone validate what you're thinking or the direction you're going. I've recently worked with clients who were very new to looking at artwork but really had sort of a gut reaction. And, I was there to say "let's follow that. Let's pursue that. Let's lean into that a little bit." The fact that you're interested in abstraction, for example, is great and let's look at lots of different ways that artists use abstraction in their practices. So that was something that was really helpful for this client for them to finally say, "actually I feel comfortable with what I'm responding to." I help guide them through that process.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: What do you with people who come in, with a family member, who maybe they like abstract art and the family member likes, let's say, cubism. How do you bring those pieces together?
Hadley Powell: I do a little bit of marital counseling in many cases because a lot of times my clients are couples or partners. It's really interesting. Usually we'll get to the point where both parties agree. So we'll say no to things that one partner loved and we'll say no to something that the other partner loved. And then, oftentimes partners or someone in the relationship, or whoever's living in the house, gets their own space; an office or a personal area or a nook. And they get to say yes to anything that goes there. And then, for other spaces in the home, a living room or family room, there's true veto power where one spouse can say no to that. I think that's really important because if someone has a creative impulse or is really passionate about something and the other one isn't, well that's life, people are individuals and people are different and you're allowed to indulge that as an individual and as a human, but for common spaces or for spaces where everyone's going to be there all the time, we definitely try to look for something that both people agree on.
Hadley Powell: I'm sure interior designers run into this all the time, too, when making decisions on the home and there are a couple people involved in the decision making.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: I have had conversations with people who are involved with selling homes. These people will share with me that it does end up being almost marital counseling sometimes because it's such a big life change and you're really committing to something. Art isn't quite to that level, but it kind of is because you're committing to the space that you're going to live in. And most people don't flip around their art, on a monthly basis, it's really something they're choosing to make part of your life.
Hadley Powell: Absolutely. It's something that's significant. And I think that some clients don't realize that buying artwork is really emotional in many ways. And the artists themselves have put so much into the piece and it's like a living breathing thing in many ways. One of my early clients, we bought a piece, it took her a while. We worked through a number of different styles and pieces and price points and everything. We landed on this great painting, kind of an abstract landscape over the couch. And afterwards she said that it was a lot harder, more emotionally taxing, than she was expecting it to be. She said, when we bought the furniture for the house, it was easy. It was, okay, that's a sofa, that's a chair and that's a rug, but this was a lot harder.
Hadley Powell: I said to her, it's because this is a unique object. It's something that someone has really put a lot of thought behind. Artwork lives in my belief. It can evoke a mood, obviously it can evoke so many emotions. And then I think once it's up on the wall, people really start responding to that, which is why I think it's so important to see things in person before you make a decision. And why so often I'm bringing carloads of artwork to client's homes. So we can start to put things up and see what the scale is like, what the colors are like, how it makes them feel. And, thankfully so many galleries are generous in letting you loan works for a couple of days, so people can sleep on it, see it during different lights, see it in the morning, see it in the evening and kind of get a sense for what this thing is going to be like in their home.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Behind me in the studio, I have a Steve Rogers painting. I know he was one of the artists that you have worked with at the Portland Art Gallery and there are several others. What are some of the things about, let's say Steve Rogers work, that you were looking at when you were considering this painting for the client you were working with.
Hadley Powell: I mean, in that example, it's the amazing perspective. And I would say the piece behind you also has that incredible perspective that it just draws you into the space. Like you're instantly outside. It looks like from what I can see, it's like a snowy field with like maybe crops that had been there fallen over, and that's what the clients were drawn to as well. What's amazing about the one that I worked with is that it was this Aspen path. So they're this gorgeous aspens and it's peak fall with beautiful yellows and oranges and it's this whole large-scale piece. And we put it in a pretty narrow, tight little dining room. And what's so great about how he composes his works is that you see you're instantly in them. And so we didn't need you to step back to kind of take in the whole picture plane.
Hadley Powell: You're just, you're instantly in it. What's also so great about the example that we're talking about is because it was these gorgeous autumnal yellows and oranges, and the client had this beautiful blue wall covering, it jumps off this wall and it really feels like it's a window into nature. And they were instantly like, “yes.” It was like an immediate response and it feels like it was painted for this room. The house in general is really a cozy, beautiful kind of traditional New England home. And so that was a really fun painting to work with because the client instantly said yes, and it just felt like such a win. And a testament to how just transportive the work generally is.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: As someone who grew up in Maine, you're obviously familiar with the landscape and the changing nature of the seasons and the beauty that's all around us. Do you think that people who are drawn to Maine may also be drawn to art because they have a connection with this sort of exterior beauty that they want to bring into their homes?
Hadley Powell: It's a really great point. I've never actually thought of it that way but there are so many creatives in Maine. There’s so many people who maybe they don't describe themselves as artists, but they knit, or they take photographs or they do a little quilting on the side. You know, there's just so many people who I think are naturally interested in the arts who live in Maine. It is so inspiring. I would say, like when we go for walks and I'm always looking at the textures and the colors or, where we are on Mount Desert Island, the granite is this really distinct pink that is just so specific to that place. And I think that if you spend time observing nature, you do become just more aware of your surroundings or color and nuances of, of the landscape.
Hadley Powell: I have a client who's a beautiful landscape painter herself and who goes to Vinalhaven. The goal of her artwork is to share with people who don't go to Vinalhaven, how beautiful it is. And, and she does that really successfully. I mean, there are these really happy, wonderful landscape paintings that when you know the craggy nature of the rocks or you know how pine trees get all gnarled because they're too close to the ocean or you know the specific color of the lichen as it develops on the tree branches or on the rocks, feel familiar. I think all of that you really can see in artwork. There's an artist, Nancy Simonds, who is based in Boston, but is represented by Portland Art Gallery. Her work is really influenced by Maine. And specifically, she has a series of ovoids that really, to me, always feel like river stones, or like the rocks on the coast of Maine. And I think I gravitate to her work so much because I'm so used to seeing the natural elements and how she brings both of those together.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: As part of people’s healing and self care during the pandemic, we’ve had a lot of people who have visited Mount Desert, so I'm sure you've noticed them in your own backyard. But also the entire state of Maine. And I think they found some peace and some solace and some healing here in a pretty significant way. Is that your sense that part of what people are kind of reaching toward is that ability to heal during these really difficult times?
Hadley Powell: It is. I’ve heard so many artists, especially artists who depict work that is really sort of natural or more sort of meditative, that they've seen a real uptick in their sales. And in talking to people who are buying their work, they have said it's because they want to look at something that makes them happy, you know, and I think there is that healing nature. And like, there are definitely certain colors that can be really soothing or relaxing. And when people are spending so much time at home, if they had blank walls, they're like, well, what do I want to put on that wall? I want to put something that makes me feel good. And so there is definitely a theme there. And there obviously have been so many studies done about the importance of being in nature, and how it can really be a mood booster.
Hadley Powell: I think about, you know, forest bathing, where people kind of go immerse themselves. Thats just something that Mainers do every day. You know, it's such a funny concept, but if you live in a more urban area, I live in Brookline, and actually we have a lot of trees, but we're pretty close to the city and I do get a sense for whenever I get up to Maine or we go for a walk or we go into a park, there is that sort of relaxation, or you kind of feel that release in many ways that the nature that nature can provide. But I do think there is a real theme where people are looking for solace, and I think it's also sort of true, it goes across different industries. I'm friends with so many interior designers, and they're really seeing people want really beautiful calming spaces, either their bedroom or their living room, or there is a real desire for that sort of connection to something that will lower your stress level in a world that's become very stressful.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Talk to me about colors, because I know that have a huge impact on our emotions. And you've been talking about calming things and soft things. Do you think that people will get to a place where they want brighter things and cheerful things, as we start to come out of Covid more?
Hadley Powell: Well, it's funny because as I'm looking in my own living room, I have some really bright artwork. It's like true pop art in some ways. One artist, Beatrice Mill Hayes, is a fabulous artist who works in a lot of collage and in primary colors. It's oranges and reds and bright blues. And another artist I have is Jeffrey Gibson, and he does wonderful, monumental works as well as works on paper and paintings. His practice is fabulous and his works are really bright, cheery pieces that are different than I think what a lot of people can live with. I've loved both artists practices for so long, that it's exciting to me. So, people gravitate toward different colors in so many different ways. It kind of is hard to describe, you know, if people will move into another color palette, but many people already are just because it's what they they're interested in.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Do you see this happen over the course of someone's life? When you were younger, do you remember liking a certain set of colors and then as you've gotten older, that changed?
Hadley Powell: I think people, not necessarily with color, but I think their engagement in the arts changes and what you like changes. And I think it's really good to be open, and okay with that, and like anything, humans evolve. I think about who I am now versus who I was 10 years ago and it is drastically different. And so every stage of life, the artwork you relate to in different ways should change with that stage of life. 10 years ago, I would never have cared about maternal images. Now. I just love looking at a beautiful Mary Cassatt or a beautiful Monet of a mother and child because that's what I'm in right now. And that's the phase of life I'm in. So with clients, they might change artwork out as their intellectual interests or personal life changes.
Hadley Powell: And so you'll hear about this in like the large art world, art market people, you know, moving out of old masters into contemporary because they're now sort of into a whole new space. And I wouldn't say my clients are doing that extreme of a change, but I think the more you look at art, the more, maybe challenging art you can sort of handle because you've sort of built up this Rolodex of images or ideas or concepts, and you start comparing different artists practices against the other one. So I think it's really reasonable for people to feel like they outgrow art over time. When I'm working with clients, I do always try to say, you know, if it's too easy right now, you're going to outgrow it really quickly. So let's find something that may be a little more rigorous so that you don't immediately feel like it's, it's too easy.
Hadley Powell: But I also share with clients like, let's, re-install your house. So if you are too used to seeing the same thing for the last five years, let's move it into a new space or give it to a child or donate it to an organization, you know, something like that. So that, you know, change is the essence of life. And so it's really, I think, important to kind of be open to the fact that the artwork you have today may not be the artwork you want to look at in 10 years. And I also on that same note, feel really comfortable with people making mistakes. The first piece of some of the first pieces that I bought in my early twenties, I'm like, it's just not the thing that I want to look at now. And that's okay. And you kind of get that out of the way so that you can make those mistakes and then kind of learn from it and move on.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Yeah. So as you're talking, I'm thinking about the poster that I had in college that I think was like, I don't know if it was Van Gogh's Starry Night or something like that, but something you buy at the college bookstore. Not to say I don't love that painting and if I had the original starry night, I'd probably put it on my wall, but since that's not likely to happen, you know, you're right. You have to kind of keep moving forward. What would you say to people who are at the beginning of their art career, their art buying or acquisition career? Because I think that people get a little intimidated if they don't have an art history background sometimes. And if you're a young professional, you're just starting out, you've got kids, you've got plenty of things to spend your money on, but maybe you want that one special piece you want, maybe it's a smaller piece. Maybe you just want something that's kind of aspirational for you. How would you direct them in that situation?
Hadley Powell: I would, again, start by just looking and look at lots and lots of things so that when you do make the decision on something, you feel really confident about it and you feel like, okay, I've reviewed everything within either the Boston market or based on a certain subject or a certain style. Feeling confident about the decision I think is really, really important and exciting. In the same breath, I love doing studio visits with artists when I can connect a client or a collector to an artist. Then they have this huge experience where they met someone and were in their studio and saw the whole practice and saw what they're working on or saw what didn't work, what was an unsuccessful painting, which is really important. Even as important as it is to see as a really successful painting.
Hadley Powell: So I think that's what ,especially sort of my generation, is really looking for: those experiences. They want to have an emotional connection in many ways to the artist and so that when someone comes into their home and asks them about the painting that's in the living room, they can say a few things about it as well as, and I got to meet the artist and it was really special. And the same goes to going to the gallery, taking artists, taking clients to, you know, see an exhibition and see 20 works by an artist is really informative to sort of the overall practice of the artist. And then also, selecting what they think is probably the best work from that group, which I think is always really interesting. So always start by looking, looking, looking, just educating yourself.
Hadley Powell: What I love about Instagram is that clients will just like send me things all the time, or, you know, I'll post something and a client will respond to it. And so that's what's also really nice is that even though we're not looking in person as much right now, we still have these digital avenues to spend time looking. The other thing that people don't really know about is that you can sometimes ask for a payment plan and sometimes galleries or artists will be really open to that. And sometimes they're not, but it's not a problem to ask. And I work with a lot of artists specifically who allow payment plans. So if you're just starting and you're like, I'm in love with this piece, but it's something that's a little out of reach. You know, there are sometimes ways to make it happen.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Well, I can't speak to Portland Art Gallery about this situation, but I think it's a unique approach. And I know that, generally I think our galleries would rather have art in the hands of people who love it than not. I mean, it doesn't do much good sitting on the gallery wall, if it could really be in someone's home.
Hadley Powell: There've been these amazing stories about collectors from like the fifties and sixties. One was a postal worker and he was so passionate. When he lived in New York, he'd go to Chelsea every single weekend with his wife and bought like Warhol. I mean, amazing artists that at the time were like these crazy contemporary artists that no one was buying and bought them all on payment plans on like a really, really conservative budget. And that went on to become, you know, these really major important collections. So that's definitely something to think about. And actually so many of my clients who are sort of now further along in their careers and have bigger budgets talk about those first pieces that they bought and they're really special to them because they're like, you know, "my wife and I had just gotten married and we were on our honeymoon and who are we to be spending any money on anything" but they fell in love with something. And that's sort of the beauty of artists that it's this really wonderful, emotional, special thing.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: And the other thing that can happen is that you can, kind of discover an artist very early in their career as they're still evolving. And maybe they're not quite as advanced as they might one day be, but there's something that kind of connects you to that artist early on. And if you start to develop a relationship with that artist's work over time, it's really something that can be kind of mutually beneficial because you're right. Everybody does continue to evolve and you're never really in the same place that you were when you started the whole journey. Is there anything else that you think you'd like to say with regard to, kind of meaning maintaining resilience during all of this. An interesting experience we've all had over the past 15 months or so with regard to the pandemic, anything about kind of how you've been able to stay with it, despite the challenges?
Hadley Powell: I mean, I think, I think one important theme, I mean, obviously being sort of a small business owner, you have moments of complete terror in the middle of the night where you think, how is this going to work or what's next month going to look like? But I think coming from a position of education and always wanting to educate no matter what, who you're talking to. So I think about that when I'm writing an Instagram post or when I'm writing an article for my newsletter or talking to a client, like, what can I give, what can I share? How can I educate? And I think that is sort of almost like the underlying thesis of my business is I want to be sharing and educating all the time. So often people will email me out of the blue saying, you know, I'm interested in maybe working with you, can you give me some information?
Hadley Powell: And I'll give them a ton of great information for free essentially. And I have clients or other friends or colleagues who say, "Oh, but you're giving that all away for free", but I think that's so important. And I never actually even think of it that way. I think of it as like, no, this is relationship building. If I have a knowledge base or an expertise, I want to share that. And so I think that's something that's sort of helped in my business is that people respond to that and appreciate it. And so that would be one sort of theme of resilience is this desire to, even when you're scared, feel open because I think when people close off or become competitive, you sort of all of a sudden, I think you present in a different way. And so that's one, another thing that I love is to sort of mentor. So I love talking with the next generation. I love being connected to other advisors or professionals in this space and building out a network, because I think only we all sort of ships all rise together in that way, and we all sort of need each other to kind of get through these hard times. So I try to be sort of as open and educating as possible through the hard times.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Wise words. And, you've given me a lot to think about it.
Hadley Powell: Well, it's been so wonderful talking to you.
Dr. Lisa Belisle: Yes. I am really pleased that you were able to take the time out of your busy day and that we made it through without your baby waking up. I appreciate the fact that you've continued to look at art as a source of inspiration through out all of this and to bring art into people's homes and help them be inspired by it as well. I've been speaking with Hadley Powell. She has an art consultant at Powell Fine Art Advisory who has worked with the Portland Art Gallery. I am Dr. Lisa Belisle. You’ve been listening to Radio Maine. Thank you so much for being with me today.